StudzPeptides wants to upgrade testing
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@mikebricker isn’t that the point if you a running a peptide business where testing is everything you don’t go with a lab that everyone in the industry knows is unreliable. Even the group buys are saying no way to freedom. All the labs have issues but they are on another level of incompetence.
I took your word on Krause and sent in a vial that was received by them last Monday. The studz guys have an issue waiting on vanguard wait until they have to deal with the handwritten PDF paperwork for Krause and the wait. I am fine with it but for a business that would be a big pain in the ass. We will have results from them eventually to compare to Janoshik and vanguard through a group buy where I sent in vials from the same batch. As long as the results are solid they are a bargain and I will use them for sure.
@Stevepep I agree - because if you know the timelines you're experiencing with the labs that people trust then you should plan and schedule your releases accordingly. It's not a difficult concept. BUT companies care about profit over people 100% of the time.
As you stated we are consenting adults, I will not be using @studzpeptides because they are choosing the easy/cheap route. I was considering them but they have made their choice. -
@Stevepep We've talked here before about why moving away from a lab like Vanguard is a tough call, and the concerns you all raised are completely fair.
That said, a lot of you were also critical of Vanguard when they made their mistake on the Eloralintide testing. It's a good reminder that no lab is 100% perfect or reliable.
Everyone has their preferred lab, and we respect that. But on the one batch we sent them, it took Vanguard 19 business days to deliver our full 7x COA. We wanted it to work, and we talked it through with them directly, but between the testing time and how long it took to go from error to fix, we just can't run our releases on that timeline.
We have 2 COAs from Vanguard, the burn blend capsules, and our domestic glutathione, that they (months ago), placed under the exact same lab ID, we have brought this up, due to multiple customer complaints, and still nothing has been changed or adjusted, and again the first of the 2 COAs, date back to 8/17
While I understand and support you guys making the decision to not buy from us due to testing, although these are all qualified labs, the experiences we have had on top of testing times and lack of fixes are just a combination of things that make it horrible to deal with on our end, and when things like this happen, how do we know things aren't being mistranslated or mis-typed etc
the one batch we sent them, it took Vanguard 19 business days to deliver our full 7x COA
That's actually a standard given that the USP 71 sterility test itself is a 14 day test. You wouldn't expect a pregnant woman to deliver a baby in 6 months instead of 9, right? Peptide testing is the same.
Also it's ironic that a business wants to go to a FAST lab with quick COAs and then say trust us, AFTER surveying here for options.
Some vendors actually moved AWAY from Freedom probably seeing the blogs and discussions here.
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@Stevepep I agree - because if you know the timelines you're experiencing with the labs that people trust then you should plan and schedule your releases accordingly. It's not a difficult concept. BUT companies care about profit over people 100% of the time.
As you stated we are consenting adults, I will not be using @studzpeptides because they are choosing the easy/cheap route. I was considering them but they have made their choice. -
hey @studzpeptides and any other vendor who "cares" or "wants to know what the public wants" here's a little refresher. It's kind of simple stuff, start from the beginning.
WE JUST WANT IT TO BE GOOD and not a rip off, we know it costs more to be thorough we aren't dollar bin shopping here.
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hey @studzpeptides and any other vendor who "cares" or "wants to know what the public wants" here's a little refresher. It's kind of simple stuff, start from the beginning.
WE JUST WANT IT TO BE GOOD and not a rip off, we know it costs more to be thorough we aren't dollar bin shopping here.
@BeeKind I just am curious as to where you guys are getting the "cheap" route from, because 7x testing from both vanguard and freedom diagnostics is actually almost identical in price, with freedom coming in slightly higher, as I have said I understand and respect where you guys are coming from,
As far as the 14 day timeline on sterility, yes you are correct, that's 14 total days, not business days, the 19 business days of time it took actually equated to approximately 28 actual days
I am not ruling out vanguard in its entirety at all, and by no means am I ignoring your feedback, I am trying to be transparent in what we are trying to do at both quality and being able to keep things stocked
We don't operate at margins that most other companies that can plan a month ahead in terms of product, and again, there is no "cheap" in our testing cost, a 7x test from freedom cost $750 per test, and I am not asking you guys to take a step-back on your opinion, but asking you to understand where we are coming from
Whether or not you guys like freedom, does not discredit the fact they are a qualified lab, and as we have seen with the Eloralintide fiasco, ALL labs are just people that state they are qualified and can and will mess up simply
Again if you choose to move away from us until we can manage to test with Vanguard full time, I respect your decision and at the end of the day I can't do anything to convince, or would want to, you are all your own researchers, at the end of the day we are doing what we can to keep things, safe, available, and affordable
There are negative reports from EVERY single lab, whether or not we want to take it to heart and apply it is up to each individual person, I have talked to countless owners and price tools that completely disregard Vanguard as a high-end lab establishment, while others love, and other who live and die by Freedom, at the end of the day we are doing what we can
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@BeeKind I just am curious as to where you guys are getting the "cheap" route from, because 7x testing from both vanguard and freedom diagnostics is actually almost identical in price, with freedom coming in slightly higher, as I have said I understand and respect where you guys are coming from,
As far as the 14 day timeline on sterility, yes you are correct, that's 14 total days, not business days, the 19 business days of time it took actually equated to approximately 28 actual days
I am not ruling out vanguard in its entirety at all, and by no means am I ignoring your feedback, I am trying to be transparent in what we are trying to do at both quality and being able to keep things stocked
We don't operate at margins that most other companies that can plan a month ahead in terms of product, and again, there is no "cheap" in our testing cost, a 7x test from freedom cost $750 per test, and I am not asking you guys to take a step-back on your opinion, but asking you to understand where we are coming from
Whether or not you guys like freedom, does not discredit the fact they are a qualified lab, and as we have seen with the Eloralintide fiasco, ALL labs are just people that state they are qualified and can and will mess up simply
Again if you choose to move away from us until we can manage to test with Vanguard full time, I respect your decision and at the end of the day I can't do anything to convince, or would want to, you are all your own researchers, at the end of the day we are doing what we can to keep things, safe, available, and affordable
There are negative reports from EVERY single lab, whether or not we want to take it to heart and apply it is up to each individual person, I have talked to countless owners and price tools that completely disregard Vanguard as a high-end lab establishment, while others love, and other who live and die by Freedom, at the end of the day we are doing what we can
@StudzPeptides I say cheap because you lack patience and planning - you went with a faster option to turn a profit quicker. And your profit margins are still padded so you can afford to test thoroughly and as stated people know that good quality testing takes time and costs money. Those that understand that, understand pricing trickles down. We're not idiots.
You came here and asked what we wanted, seemed like you genuinely card but you decided to go the cheap/fast route. -
@StudzPeptides I say cheap because you lack patience and planning - you went with a faster option to turn a profit quicker. And your profit margins are still padded so you can afford to test thoroughly and as stated people know that good quality testing takes time and costs money. Those that understand that, understand pricing trickles down. We're not idiots.
You came here and asked what we wanted, seemed like you genuinely card but you decided to go the cheap/fast route.@BeeKind Bee it has nothing to do with planning or patience, it has to due with margins, we run a low margin business, to keep things affordable, if we were running prices like most other places we would have absolutely no difficulty ordering a month ahead of time, but no lab regardless of that should take a month to release a COA
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@BeeKind I just am curious as to where you guys are getting the "cheap" route from, because 7x testing from both vanguard and freedom diagnostics is actually almost identical in price, with freedom coming in slightly higher, as I have said I understand and respect where you guys are coming from,
As far as the 14 day timeline on sterility, yes you are correct, that's 14 total days, not business days, the 19 business days of time it took actually equated to approximately 28 actual days
I am not ruling out vanguard in its entirety at all, and by no means am I ignoring your feedback, I am trying to be transparent in what we are trying to do at both quality and being able to keep things stocked
We don't operate at margins that most other companies that can plan a month ahead in terms of product, and again, there is no "cheap" in our testing cost, a 7x test from freedom cost $750 per test, and I am not asking you guys to take a step-back on your opinion, but asking you to understand where we are coming from
Whether or not you guys like freedom, does not discredit the fact they are a qualified lab, and as we have seen with the Eloralintide fiasco, ALL labs are just people that state they are qualified and can and will mess up simply
Again if you choose to move away from us until we can manage to test with Vanguard full time, I respect your decision and at the end of the day I can't do anything to convince, or would want to, you are all your own researchers, at the end of the day we are doing what we can to keep things, safe, available, and affordable
There are negative reports from EVERY single lab, whether or not we want to take it to heart and apply it is up to each individual person, I have talked to countless owners and price tools that completely disregard Vanguard as a high-end lab establishment, while others love, and other who live and die by Freedom, at the end of the day we are doing what we can
@StudzPeptides Good response. I wouldn’t overplay the opinions of a few. As you said, a qualified lab is what buyers are looking for, and 99% of those don’t really care or even consider which lab provided the testing, as long as it passes.
I for one think anything above PPID, Endo and Sterility is overkill. And to be honest, sterility sounds good but how many times have we seen that fail? I look at purity, fill, and Endo when I review a vial I intend to buy. I don’t look at heavy metals….
but I do love Metallica.
From a business and QA perspective I think you’re doing the right thing. Keep up the good work.
Just think, if you used Vanguard you could say your vials were filled 50% higher than label amount.
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@BeeKind Bee it has nothing to do with planning or patience, it has to due with margins, we run a low margin business, to keep things affordable, if we were running prices like most other places we would have absolutely no difficulty ordering a month ahead of time, but no lab regardless of that should take a month to release a COA
@StudzPeptides It is always about planning. But regardless you've got a fan with @mikebricker so don't worry about my opinion. I've already decided against you.
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@StudzPeptides It is always about planning. But regardless you've got a fan with @mikebricker so don't worry about my opinion. I've already decided against you.
@BeeKind Sounds good, I hope you have a great day, at the end of the day we are doing what we can whether or not it seems that way
I respect what you have to say, even if I don't agree with it
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@StudzPeptides It is always about planning. But regardless you've got a fan with @mikebricker so don't worry about my opinion. I've already decided against you.
@BeeKind Exactly. I’m a fan of Uther, Chengdu and Nexaph, since I buy boxes not single vials. But when I want to try something out, I’ll buy a vial or three from a single vial seller, and that’s StudzPeptides.
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@BeeKind Exactly. I’m a fan of Uther, Chengdu and Nexaph, since I buy boxes not single vials. But when I want to try something out, I’ll buy a vial or three from a single vial seller, and that’s StudzPeptides.
@mikebricker We also have great kit pricing:)
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@mikebricker We also have great kit pricing:)
@mikebricker We also have great kit pricing:)
@StudzPeptides Studz, you opened that door. So get me a 10 vial kit of 10mg Eloralintide for $350 and now you’re cooking…. Or a 10 vial kit 10mg of Retatrutide for $120….
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yeesh, check out for some deals coming and we may get close, but I dont know about beating that
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@Stevepep We've talked here before about why moving away from a lab like Vanguard is a tough call, and the concerns you all raised are completely fair.
That said, a lot of you were also critical of Vanguard when they made their mistake on the Eloralintide testing. It's a good reminder that no lab is 100% perfect or reliable.
Everyone has their preferred lab, and we respect that. But on the one batch we sent them, it took Vanguard 19 business days to deliver our full 7x COA. We wanted it to work, and we talked it through with them directly, but between the testing time and how long it took to go from error to fix, we just can't run our releases on that timeline.
We have 2 COAs from Vanguard, the burn blend capsules, and our domestic glutathione, that they (months ago), placed under the exact same lab ID, we have brought this up, due to multiple customer complaints, and still nothing has been changed or adjusted, and again the first of the 2 COAs, date back to 8/17
While I understand and support you guys making the decision to not buy from us due to testing, although these are all qualified labs, the experiences we have had on top of testing times and lack of fixes are just a combination of things that make it horrible to deal with on our end, and when things like this happen, how do we know things aren't being mistranslated or mis-typed etc
@StudzPeptides USP 71 is a 14 day test minimum, add 3-5 days for confirmation if you have a positive. Freedom does a PCR screen that is not sterility, its essentially bioburden. I test with Trustpointe and Vanguard. If I get sterility they send a preliminary pq and endotoxins result in about three days. Ive worked in QC and used to be an ISO 17025 auditor, what freedom and ILS pass off for results is embarrassing.
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@StudzPeptides USP 71 is a 14 day test minimum, add 3-5 days for confirmation if you have a positive. Freedom does a PCR screen that is not sterility, its essentially bioburden. I test with Trustpointe and Vanguard. If I get sterility they send a preliminary pq and endotoxins result in about three days. Ive worked in QC and used to be an ISO 17025 auditor, what freedom and ILS pass off for results is embarrassing.
This post is deleted! -
@BeeKind I just am curious as to where you guys are getting the "cheap" route from, because 7x testing from both vanguard and freedom diagnostics is actually almost identical in price, with freedom coming in slightly higher, as I have said I understand and respect where you guys are coming from,
As far as the 14 day timeline on sterility, yes you are correct, that's 14 total days, not business days, the 19 business days of time it took actually equated to approximately 28 actual days
I am not ruling out vanguard in its entirety at all, and by no means am I ignoring your feedback, I am trying to be transparent in what we are trying to do at both quality and being able to keep things stocked
We don't operate at margins that most other companies that can plan a month ahead in terms of product, and again, there is no "cheap" in our testing cost, a 7x test from freedom cost $750 per test, and I am not asking you guys to take a step-back on your opinion, but asking you to understand where we are coming from
Whether or not you guys like freedom, does not discredit the fact they are a qualified lab, and as we have seen with the Eloralintide fiasco, ALL labs are just people that state they are qualified and can and will mess up simply
Again if you choose to move away from us until we can manage to test with Vanguard full time, I respect your decision and at the end of the day I can't do anything to convince, or would want to, you are all your own researchers, at the end of the day we are doing what we can to keep things, safe, available, and affordable
There are negative reports from EVERY single lab, whether or not we want to take it to heart and apply it is up to each individual person, I have talked to countless owners and price tools that completely disregard Vanguard as a high-end lab establishment, while others love, and other who live and die by Freedom, at the end of the day we are doing what we can
@BeeKind I just am curious as to where you guys are getting the "cheap" route from, because 7x testing from both vanguard and freedom diagnostics is actually almost identical in price, with freedom coming in slightly higher, as I have said I understand and respect where you guys are coming from,
As far as the 14 day timeline on sterility, yes you are correct, that's 14 total days, not business days, the 19 business days of time it took actually equated to approximately 28 actual days
I am not ruling out vanguard in its entirety at all, and by no means am I ignoring your feedback, I am trying to be transparent in what we are trying to do at both quality and being able to keep things stocked
We don't operate at margins that most other companies that can plan a month ahead in terms of product, and again, there is no "cheap" in our testing cost, a 7x test from freedom cost $750 per test, and I am not asking you guys to take a step-back on your opinion, but asking you to understand where we are coming from
Whether or not you guys like freedom, does not discredit the fact they are a qualified lab, and as we have seen with the Eloralintide fiasco, ALL labs are just people that state they are qualified and can and will mess up simply
Again if you choose to move away from us until we can manage to test with Vanguard full time, I respect your decision and at the end of the day I can't do anything to convince, or would want to, you are all your own researchers, at the end of the day we are doing what we can to keep things, safe, available, and affordable
There are negative reports from EVERY single lab, whether or not we want to take it to heart and apply it is up to each individual person, I have talked to countless owners and price tools that completely disregard Vanguard as a high-end lab establishment, while others love, and other who live and die by Freedom, at the end of the day we are doing what we can
Studz it’s understandable your frustration with Vanguard on their timing and not being able to fix a coa for you for months. But I believe the general consensus and seems to be growing even outside this community is that Freedom is absolutely unreliable. The bottom of the barrel, just above absolute made up scam labs. Your business and your decision if you want to continue to use Freedom, but at least for this community and maybe others who are starting to feel the same way, there’s nothing really separating you from the retail competition out there then. You have good prices for retail, and you are responsive in this community, but it’s the 3rd factor of using a better lab that was the home run for you in my opinion. Take away the lab aspect and then I feel like I should just buy grey at even cheaper prices.
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@StudzPeptides USP 71 is a 14 day test minimum, add 3-5 days for confirmation if you have a positive. Freedom does a PCR screen that is not sterility, its essentially bioburden. I test with Trustpointe and Vanguard. If I get sterility they send a preliminary pq and endotoxins result in about three days. Ive worked in QC and used to be an ISO 17025 auditor, what freedom and ILS pass off for results is embarrassing.
@pure_pep They don't care they know Freedom stinks and its been well documented. They want fast and they want to win on price not quality. They order grey like we can do ourselves and get it tested by a crappy lab. Freedom has passed peptides for endotoxins and sterility that failed at other labs. IMO if I want grey with crappy testing I can get it myself far cheaper and then test on my own than to deal with a company that preaches they want to upgrade their testing, than asks this well informed group and then goes the opposite direction.
They don't practice what they preach, bottom line.
Freedom is being called out by group buys, on telegram and we have downright proof on here that they are horrible yet these guys run to them. Thats all you really need to know about thier business practices and this after they came on here acting like they give a crap. Buyer beware. They got me and I was stupid enough to fall far it and sold thousands of dollars of stuff for them. Never again, foul me once
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@StudzPeptides Good response. I wouldn’t overplay the opinions of a few. As you said, a qualified lab is what buyers are looking for, and 99% of those don’t really care or even consider which lab provided the testing, as long as it passes.
I for one think anything above PPID, Endo and Sterility is overkill. And to be honest, sterility sounds good but how many times have we seen that fail? I look at purity, fill, and Endo when I review a vial I intend to buy. I don’t look at heavy metals…. but I do love Metallica.
From a business and QA perspective I think you’re doing the right thing. Keep up the good work.
Just think, if you used Vanguard you could say your vials were filled 50% higher than label amount.@mikebricker This sounds like an N-1.
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This community has quite a bit of people who post on here, but considerable more who don't post and just browse and read our posts for recommendations on where to buy and what to look out for like which labs are reputable and which are not. I am sure @studzpeptides is well aware of this and that's why he's here on this community for exposure and more business. I will always like him and give him credit in that he never came here like other vendors spamming their website and hijacking other threads. He was always upfront and honest so that's a plus in my book.
The truth is, the peptide industry is WAY oversaturated with vendors now. There is no real barrier to entry in this business. The hardest part is getting Credit Card processing and keeping it from getting shutting down. @studzpeptides is late to this business and who knows how many new retail vendors are popping up daily. Anyone can put up a website tomorrow and start reselling peptides just like some guys do at 24 hour fitness and some housewives do at Lifetime. Just reselling shit out of their gym bag. It is a race to the bottom, but if you want to stand out from the competition, then you do what @studzpeptides seemed to wanted to do, and come on this board and ask what we want and deliver on that. The fact that this thread has so many views and replies, people constantly checking his site for Vanguard COAs, prove that it was working. Look at how many other vendors are mentioned here and get little to no engagement at all because they are a dime a dozen.
But again his business, and is free to run it how he wants to. You will have some like @mikebricker who are fine with Freedom. His body, his money. But I imagine the overwhelming majority of informed peptide users that post here, and browse here, do care about what they are injecting and who is testing it. If you want to take away business from the big established and credible guys like Nexaph, you have to hit a home run out of the park. A double is not going to do it anymore with all the competition out there.
It's like being sandwiched between Walmart on the bottom end, and Target on the top end. Either be Walmart or be Target. Unfortunately you can't be Walmart as that is just buying grey directly or from Nexaph. So instead be the Target and offer better quality (testing) while still trying to be somewhat competitive in pricing.
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