We tested peptide degradation so people can stop guessing
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@randy Not that I'm questioning you, but in the interest of openness I'm curious if your actual test result docs state that this was reconstituted vials tested. The reason I ask is there are gymbros on dudetube saying the same things, but the test results (in one particular example from Janoshik) say nothing about whether the test was on reconstituted peptide or just lyophilized. Again not saying you are being dishonest, but the other guy's test results were definitely ambiguous.
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I'm curious to see the sharp drop after a few months for Tirz even in the fridge. How does the pharma pen stay valid for their expiry dates?
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I'm curious to see the sharp drop after a few months for Tirz even in the fridge. How does the pharma pen stay valid for their expiry dates?
@bangkokiscool Pharmaceuticals pens and compounding have a lot of additives to stabalize. IVMedco compounded Tirzepatide for example is Tirz, Vitamin B12, Sodium Chloride, Sodium Dibasic Heptahydrate and Water plus HCL to balance ph if needed.
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@daring Not really — the fridge samples in the study sat the entire time at room temp and showed little drop by day 15 even. The brief temperature excursion from pulling a vial out, drawing a dose, and putting it back takes maybe 30–60 seconds and barely moves the needle on cumulative thermal exposure. If if you let it warm up to room temp before putting it back i thats only hours of time at room temp over the course of a cart, The bigger drivers are overall storage temperature and time.
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@daring I was curious about the same thing so ran it through AI and here what was reported:
"One stability guide notes that if reconstituted MOTS‑c is kept at 4 °C continuously, it stays >95% pure for about 28 days; intermittent warm excursions accelerate loss, dropping to ~85% by 14 days and <70% by 28 days when repeatedly warmed to room temperature."
This correlates somewhat with what Jeff reported on his very awesome study (Thank You Jeff!) although his study reported more degradation at 31 days than sighted here.
Nonetheless, given enough correlation I think I can assume with a high degree of confidence based on both sources of info that yes I could expect MOTS C to degrade considerably more warming to room temperature for injection rather than continuously refrigerating.
I also asked AI about injecting sub peptide at 35 degrees F...
"For a typical subcutaneous peptide injection (like 0.25–0.5 mL in belly fat), having the solution very cold mainly increases local discomfort and the chance of a small lump or irritation, but it’s unlikely to cause deep or systemic damage by itself."
Based on all of this, I think I'll refrigerate of course, take my pen straight away and inject sub then put peptidecritic pen back into the frig. Not recommending this to anyone else but that's what I think I'll do for my rat. Of course it depends on lots of different variables not the least of which how long you expect your vial to be stored before being fully dispensed into your rat.
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@kj4otu "All samples in this study were prepared using bacteriostatic water with 0.9% benzyl alcohol."
It's sprinkled all throughout the post.
If we didn't reconstitute them, the tests would be worthless. There would also be no degradation of any kind.
@Randy I get that you said it multiple times. I am asking about the actual coa document/lab results from the testing lab. I would like to see that posted and would like to see it state the actual test parameter. Like I said, I’m not trying to question your statement just asking for verification. Others posting these same comments in testing have also not shown the actual test results from the lab. Your stuff seems different/more legit so I assumed you would jump at the chance to show lab verification. No offense but I don't actually know you. Trust but verify you know. Again not trying to just make waves here.
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@kj4otu If your read this post he clearly spell it out "one diluent type"
@brandenscheidecker if you’ll read my post you see that I acknowledge what he SAYS but I am asking for the actual documents from the lab showing the test parameters. I’ve yet to see anyone claiming to do this test that shows the labs docs listing the test parameters as reconstituted. I would like to see it truly put to bed. Trust but verify man. I think that is the name of the game in this industry. At least if you’re smart.
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@Randy I get that you said it multiple times. I am asking about the actual coa document/lab results from the testing lab. I would like to see that posted and would like to see it state the actual test parameter. Like I said, I’m not trying to question your statement just asking for verification. Others posting these same comments in testing have also not shown the actual test results from the lab. Your stuff seems different/more legit so I assumed you would jump at the chance to show lab verification. No offense but I don't actually know you. Trust but verify you know. Again not trying to just make waves here.
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@commander yeah they're useless unless you are the lab tech.
@kj4otu asked for the raw results after not reading the original post saying what the dilutant was. Believe the data or don't. ...or better yet spend 5k on tests and do it yourself
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@commander yeah they're useless unless you are the lab tech.
@kj4otu asked for the raw results after not reading the original post saying what the dilutant was. Believe the data or don't. ...or better yet spend 5k on tests and do it yourself
@Randy said in We tested peptide degradation so people can stop guessing:
@kj4otu asked for the raw results after not reading the original post saying what the dilutant was. Believe the data or don't. ...or better yet spend 5k on tests and do it yourself
Illustrative example of why we just can't have nice things anymore.
"or better yet spend 5k on tests and do it yourself :)"
I really appreciate all that you do Jeff! Thanks for the stability reports, tremendous value. AT NO COST TO ME
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@matthewwalsh I inject cold all the time; I don’t care. I don’t think there is any more discomfort than at room temperature, or, again, I don’t care. If that is a concern, do what I do for my bride’s rat(she has concierge service!) and draw the syringe, letting that get to room temperature while the vial is back in the fridge.
Be wary using AI for this. It’s mostly scraping all the other web sites and posters, which are all either repeating one source(e.g. bac water goes bad after 28 days) or are aggregating made up stuff that isn’t verified.
I am not saying it isn’t useful, but I am using AI for work and it’s just great when you ask it to summarize regulatory requirements for financial derivatives and it makes up answers when it can’t find what you’re looking for.
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@matthewwalsh I inject cold all the time; I don’t care. I don’t think there is any more discomfort than at room temperature, or, again, I don’t care. If that is a concern, do what I do for my bride’s rat(she has concierge service!) and draw the syringe, letting that get to room temperature while the vial is back in the fridge.
Be wary using AI for this. It’s mostly scraping all the other web sites and posters, which are all either repeating one source(e.g. bac water goes bad after 28 days) or are aggregating made up stuff that isn’t verified.
I am not saying it isn’t useful, but I am using AI for work and it’s just great when you ask it to summarize regulatory requirements for financial derivatives and it makes up answers when it can’t find what you’re looking for.
@ResearchCat Wise advice! Great to get your testimonial on injecting cold - way more helpful to hear real life applications than from a machine for sure. I so appreciate Jeff paying for and sharing real testing results that gives me great confidence in my approach.
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And btw... I'm using peptidecritic v4 pen and would highly recommend that to anyone - bought more than one and love these peptide pens. Just so damn convenient (and not painful at all) over single injection syringe.
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@matthewwalsh I inject cold all the time; I don’t care. I don’t think there is any more discomfort than at room temperature, or, again, I don’t care. If that is a concern, do what I do for my bride’s rat(she has concierge service!) and draw the syringe, letting that get to room temperature while the vial is back in the fridge.
Be wary using AI for this. It’s mostly scraping all the other web sites and posters, which are all either repeating one source(e.g. bac water goes bad after 28 days) or are aggregating made up stuff that isn’t verified.
I am not saying it isn’t useful, but I am using AI for work and it’s just great when you ask it to summarize regulatory requirements for financial derivatives and it makes up answers when it can’t find what you’re looking for.
@ResearchCat
Yep, way too many people rely on AI…. -
@commander yeah they're useless unless you are the lab tech.
@kj4otu asked for the raw results after not reading the original post saying what the dilutant was. Believe the data or don't. ...or better yet spend 5k on tests and do it yourself
@Randy Nope. I read it all and told you I did. You say yourself to question everything. So there you go. Thanks for the data. I appreciate it. Also, as I said before, I appreciate what you do, I'm just trying to dig deeper as I hear you guys say all the time. I do get that you aren't selling this stuff, so you really don't have a reason to fake anything, but with this stuff I really don't trust much of anyone without verification. I don't think you can blame me lol.
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Thanks for this and the video Jeff and @randy !
For Tirz, assuming it’s pharma 503b grade (different water for injection and solution, but bear with me here)is it safe to assume that it stays pretty well situated in the fridge (assuming it’s not being degraded by light) for at least 61 days if we are to assume the first day is the Best use date/ BUD? Curious because I’ve heard people use meds way past BUD date and swore it’s ok
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