Freedom Again
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@ogsteve I don’t like freedom because they have proven to be inaccurate on purity, endotoxins and sterility other than that they are great. This was proven out by vendors themselves sending samples to multiple labs.
Vendors opt out of the photos at every lab it’s not the lab it’s the vendor on that issue.
Filtering will not get all contaminants I filter as an added safety step. Not caring about sterility is nuts imo. Killing off the bacteria creates endotoxins they go hand and hand for the most part. Peter from Janoshik has said many times if a sample passes sterility it’s is extremely rare to not pass endotoxins and said the opposite is also true. In fact he said he would just test for sterility and not endotoxins.
@Stevepep lol. I hear what you are saying. Personally i dont interpret the data like that as its more of a correlation vs causation arguement on whether the individual vial was bad or the extended shipping time to Czechoslovakia or the lab methodology or the preparation (ever seen them dip into that giant open container of sterile water repeatedly?). There are just too many intervening factors for me to outright condemn a lab that at least consistently produces quality COAs with the requisite data every time.
Now when we get to the 99.89% consistent results, I don’t agree with not including peaks outside of the identified compound in the overall purity percentage. Were it me I would like to have all of the items in the vile listed along with the amount that’s in there. To me that’s real data and I agree with your condemnation on that front 100%. Of course that is certainly not limited to freedom diagnostics
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I run Blackline Scientific, and Freedom tests every batch we sell, so I read this thread closely. If a report is wrong, post the full report and the batch it belongs to so it can be checked line by line. That is fair game and it should be. What I can say from our side is that every certificate for our products is published on the product page for anyone to read before ordering, and when a question comes up we answer it in the open. Testing only means something when the reports stay public and anyone can question them.
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@ogsteve endos may come along for the ride with non-sterility unfortunately. Think levels likely depend upon how much growth there's been in the vial and the resulting garbage generated. Another reason to keep things chilled and dry if possible; cooling and dehydration slow growth.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/endotoxin
"Endotoxin is defined as a toxic substance released from the outer membrane of certain bacteria, such as E. coli, primarily consisting of lipopolysaccharide (LPS), which includes lipid A. It is responsible for various diseases in humans and is a significant contaminant in the pharmaceutical and food industries."@senex_mus I agree with this. My point was that, even if it has bacteria in the vile that caused the endotoxins, the bacteria is not producing any more endotoxins while it’s in the vile. Only once it’s reconstitute, it is capable of producing more endotoxins at which point we just filter the bacteria out and move on with life.
Does that make sense. Am I missing something?
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I run Blackline Scientific, and Freedom tests every batch we sell, so I read this thread closely. If a report is wrong, post the full report and the batch it belongs to so it can be checked line by line. That is fair game and it should be. What I can say from our side is that every certificate for our products is published on the product page for anyone to read before ordering, and when a question comes up we answer it in the open. Testing only means something when the reports stay public and anyone can question them.
I run Blackline Scientific, and Freedom tests every batch we sell, so I read this thread closely. If a report is wrong, post the full report and the batch it belongs to so it can be checked line by line. That is fair game and it should be. What I can say from our side is that every certificate for our products is published on the product page for anyone to read before ordering, and when a question comes up we answer it in the open. Testing only means something when the reports stay public and anyone can question them.
Clearly you haven't been paying attention and just here to spam your site. Go spend some time on here and read why we DO NOT respect Freedom Lab which you are using. Has nothing to do with just publishing COA's. That's an obvious that every vendor should be doing at the very least.
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@senex_mus I agree with this. My point was that, even if it has bacteria in the vile that caused the endotoxins, the bacteria is not producing any more endotoxins while it’s in the vile. Only once it’s reconstitute, it is capable of producing more endotoxins at which point we just filter the bacteria out and move on with life.
Does that make sense. Am I missing something?
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@senex_mus I agree with this. My point was that, even if it has bacteria in the vile that caused the endotoxins, the bacteria is not producing any more endotoxins while it’s in the vile. Only once it’s reconstitute, it is capable of producing more endotoxins at which point we just filter the bacteria out and move on with life.
Does that make sense. Am I missing something?
@ogsteve This is not right. Endotoxins residues even without active bacteria can cause serious adverse research outcomes and they don't get filtered out using regular pep filters.
Recall that JEEP Tirz batches with horrendous endotoxins levels had passed sterility tests. You can find COAs on this forum.
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I run Blackline Scientific, and Freedom tests every batch we sell, so I read this thread closely. If a report is wrong, post the full report and the batch it belongs to so it can be checked line by line. That is fair game and it should be. What I can say from our side is that every certificate for our products is published on the product page for anyone to read before ordering, and when a question comes up we answer it in the open. Testing only means something when the reports stay public and anyone can question them.
Clearly you haven't been paying attention and just here to spam your site. Go spend some time on here and read why we DO NOT respect Freedom Lab which you are using. Has nothing to do with just publishing COA's. That's an obvious that every vendor should be doing at the very least.
@denti Yup, amusing how vendors feel offended when they see critical content on the labs they are using.
Instead of bringing their receipts to prove their testing, say COAs from another lab that the forum vets, they get in the mud to defend their lab. Vendor and lab romance is a huge red flag.
I think Randy needs to create a separate directory — vendors with subpar labs yet hostile attitude.
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@randy I think you have another red banner to add for Blackline-Scientific above. LOL they don't even have COA's posted for a lot of their items they sell. Instead they have a pdf of "Safety Data Sheet" for some of their items. Some of these vendors really are the dumbest people out there. Come on this site, which has a load of informed members, and try to spam your site while you own yourself. Amazing.
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https://community.peptidecritic.com/topic/3540/discussion-blackline-scientific
https://peptidecritic.com/vendor/blackline-scientific
They list "the collective" on "their tests" when they are available. Its so lazy I cant even.
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https://community.peptidecritic.com/topic/3540/discussion-blackline-scientific
https://peptidecritic.com/vendor/blackline-scientific
They list "the collective" on "their tests" when they are available. Its so lazy I cant even.
https://community.peptidecritic.com/topic/3540/discussion-blackline-scientific
https://peptidecritic.com/vendor/blackline-scientific
They list "the collective" on "their tests" when they are available. Its so lazy I cant even.
Everyone should check out Randy's links for Blackline Scientific. You will certainly enjoy the comedy on how dumb this vendor is and how easily they got caught.
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@ogsteve This is not right. Endotoxins residues even without active bacteria can cause serious adverse research outcomes and they don't get filtered out using regular pep filters.
Recall that JEEP Tirz batches with horrendous endotoxins levels had passed sterility tests. You can find COAs on this forum.
@pep_researcher that's not what I read or agreed to.
Essentially, filtering will remove bacteria and no more endotoxins will be introduced.
No way to get rid of the current endotoxin load, just limit or stop more being introduced, and of course, injecting your test subject with bacteria.
Endotoxins can be introduced anywhere in the manufacturing process. No bacteria required even. There is no way to get rid of them w/o destroying the product unfortunately. GMP is the product being filtered as it's being pumped into the fill room for lophilization. Any slight contamination problem in the fill, and the product is non-sterile. Sterility in the fill that I worked in was much, much more rigorous that any hospital operating room that I've seen.
Filter sterilization will at least remove bacteria and limit further endotoxin production. Best you can do since there is no iron clad guarantee of sterility.
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@ogsteve This is not right. Endotoxins residues even without active bacteria can cause serious adverse research outcomes and they don't get filtered out using regular pep filters.
Recall that JEEP Tirz batches with horrendous endotoxins levels had passed sterility tests. You can find COAs on this forum.
@pep_researcher maybe re-read my comment. I never said anything about filtering endotoxins.
Endo bad…
Sterilty… dont care. Just filter.The Endo that’s in the vial doesn’t get any worse while it’s in the vial.
The bacteria that cause the endo get filtered at recon.
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@pep_researcher maybe re-read my comment. I never said anything about filtering endotoxins.
Endo bad…
Sterilty… dont care. Just filter.The Endo that’s in the vial doesn’t get any worse while it’s in the vial.
The bacteria that cause the endo get filtered at recon.
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