New Lab - Koverlabs, a bit concerning?
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@user_12968 i appreciate that you finally came on here to help us get a better understanding. The issue I have is you really screwed over Glacier who are great people. I stopped ordering from them as did many others because we didn’t trust your lab results. You never get back lost revenue people just go somewhere else. You should have just done the damn test and stayed on here and communicated .
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@user_12968 I appreciate you coming back here with detailed explanations. That is what I would expect from the beginning. If you just sent that sample as an ordinary one it would cut all the drama.
I have a question, why don't you print MS chart along with HPLC chart on your report as the other companies do? It is the most useful chart and it would be a record that you do test the identity.@vpeptide Just a design choice really. My initial intent was to build a COA page that was able to provide as much testing data as possible.
The COA is meant to be easily digestible by the wide gamut of end-users who have varying degrees of knowledge of the testing process. The actual COA page is supposed to be the home of the entire data package including the COA, extra add-on reports, raw data, along with pictures and video of the testing process.
Frankly I just got extremely busy and the demand wasn't there for it. Usually clients would just download the pdf and upload it to their site because that was what they were used to.
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@user_12968 i appreciate that you finally came on here to help us get a better understanding. The issue I have is you really screwed over Glacier who are great people. I stopped ordering from them as did many others because we didn’t trust your lab results. You never get back lost revenue people just go somewhere else. You should have just done the damn test and stayed on here and communicated .
@Stevepep I think Steve is doing great, but I understand the sentiment. I've also saved him a couple of times from errant testing results from competing labs so quantifying net gain will never be simple.
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@Stevepep I think Steve is doing great, but I understand the sentiment. I've also saved him a couple of times from errant testing results from competing labs so quantifying net gain will never be simple.
@user_12968 Appreciate it. I hope you stay active over here; a lot of us do our own testing as well. You have certainly made me feel more comfortable. I have Kisspepin from Mile High and haven't taken it because you did the testing. Now I will. I really do appreciate you coming on here. I am a lifelong entrepreneur, so I sympathize with the growing pains and hope for your success it certainly looks like you are on your way
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@user_12968 Appreciate it. I hope you stay active over here; a lot of us do our own testing as well. You have certainly made me feel more comfortable. I have Kisspepin from Mile High and haven't taken it because you did the testing. Now I will. I really do appreciate you coming on here. I am a lifelong entrepreneur, so I sympathize with the growing pains and hope for your success it certainly looks like you are on your way
@Stevepep Thank you for your understanding and words of encouragement. I'm trying my best to build the business to the best of my abilities but am always open to constructive criticism.
Apologies if I don't respond in the future but I'll check back once in a while.
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@vpeptide Just a design choice really. My initial intent was to build a COA page that was able to provide as much testing data as possible.
The COA is meant to be easily digestible by the wide gamut of end-users who have varying degrees of knowledge of the testing process. The actual COA page is supposed to be the home of the entire data package including the COA, extra add-on reports, raw data, along with pictures and video of the testing process.
Frankly I just got extremely busy and the demand wasn't there for it. Usually clients would just download the pdf and upload it to their site because that was what they were used to.
@user_12968 Do you realize someone took that actual photo and added what looked like an octopus inside to make it look like you and Glacier were sketchy? I could tell right away it was photoshopped, and I posted about it. Scroll up and you will see it
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@user_12968 Do you realize someone took that actual photo and added what looked like an octopus inside to make it look like you and Glacier were sketchy? I could tell right away it was photoshopped, and I posted about it. Scroll up and you will see it
@Stevepep The vial insert does look like it has tentacles, is that what you are referring to or did they actually photoshop something extra? Thank you either way.
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@Stevepep The vial insert does look like it has tentacles, is that what you are referring to or did they actually photoshop something extra? Thank you either way.
@user_12968 Hysterical; that was trying to be passed off as Viral or Bacteria. Some of this is nuts. Having been in the business, it doesn't grow that way. I think it came from Discord or Telegram.
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@gym.rat
@pep_researcher To be clear I do trust what ever results I get from Kovera and have cross checked results of a recent product with Vanguard and they were spot on. AJ does share the raw data as well and will answer questions if I ask. I will say he is going through growing pains though as we all have. I'm sure his response time will increase when he hires some help.
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@Stevepep I think Steve is doing great, but I understand the sentiment. I've also saved him a couple of times from errant testing results from competing labs so quantifying net gain will never be simple.
@user_12968 This is true, and it was from one of the "ISO" labs in the USA
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So at least Kovera is now responding. Maybe we give him a chance to redeem himself…
iLS is now TERRIBLE with their timeframes. We need a good lab, with good communication.
So far the best communication from a lab for me has been with AFi. Hopefully Kovera steps up. I can say this their web portal is the best I have used so far -
So at least Kovera is now responding. Maybe we give him a chance to redeem himself…
iLS is now TERRIBLE with their timeframes. We need a good lab, with good communication.
So far the best communication from a lab for me has been with AFi. Hopefully Kovera steps up. I can say this their web portal is the best I have used so far -
@gym.rat
@pep_researcher To be clear I do trust what ever results I get from Kovera and have cross checked results of a recent product with Vanguard and they were spot on. AJ does share the raw data as well and will answer questions if I ask. I will say he is going through growing pains though as we all have. I'm sure his response time will increase when he hires some help.
@GLACIER-AMINOS My guys. So happy this got cleared up
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@glacier-aminos I’ve purchased from you guys and MHC and have had no issues with the product but the unprofessional responses in this thread to a reasonable question of legitimacy for an unknown/new lab has turned me off. Unfortunately for now, any company in business with this lab has lost at least this customer.
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@user_12968 Rude? I think the larger issue is that you accepted our money and samples, ran the tests, and then did not provide the results. After more than a month without results or meaningful communication, I had to file a chargeback.
And the chargeback only addressed the testing fee. The samples themselves cost money, they were gone, and the cost of shipping them to you was gone as well. Refusing to contest the chargeback did not make me whole or resolve the underlying problem.
You’ve now said the results were withheld because you objected to how I spoke to you. You don’t have to like a customer, but once you accept payment and samples, the professional options are to complete the work or promptly cancel the order, issue a refund, communicate that decision, and return anything that can still be returned.
Before assuming I’m an outsider acting with bad intentions, it may be worth speaking with some of your largest clients, including the vendor who provided funding for equipment early on. I’ve independently confirmed that arrangement with multiple sources.
I had no malicious intent in running these tests. I paid for them myself because I wanted to independently confirm for the community that Kovera was running a clean operation. Had the results held up, I would have said so publicly. That would have reflected well on you and your lab.
I’m also aware that you’ve identified issues with testing from ILS and Freedom. I have a botched Freedom test sitting in my own email. No lab is perfect, and nobody reasonable expects one to be.
But equipment and methodology are only part of running a successful laboratory. Communication, consistency, and professionalism matter too. If customers believe results may be withheld because of a personal disagreement, they’ll hesitate to test with you, and they may also hesitate to rely on the RUO vendors whose products are supported by your COAs.
You didn’t have to agree with me or like how I raised the issue. You just needed to complete the work we paid for, or clearly tell us that you would not.
"If it doesnt come in a needle. It doesn't work"
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@glacier-aminos I’ve purchased from you guys and MHC and have had no issues with the product but the unprofessional responses in this thread to a reasonable question of legitimacy for an unknown/new lab has turned me off. Unfortunately for now, any company in business with this lab has lost at least this customer.
@WesEqualshXc The guy made a mistake; he has come on here to give a better explanation. That's at least how I see it.
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@user_12968 Rude? I think the larger issue is that you accepted our money and samples, ran the tests, and then did not provide the results. After more than a month without results or meaningful communication, I had to file a chargeback.
And the chargeback only addressed the testing fee. The samples themselves cost money, they were gone, and the cost of shipping them to you was gone as well. Refusing to contest the chargeback did not make me whole or resolve the underlying problem.
You’ve now said the results were withheld because you objected to how I spoke to you. You don’t have to like a customer, but once you accept payment and samples, the professional options are to complete the work or promptly cancel the order, issue a refund, communicate that decision, and return anything that can still be returned.
Before assuming I’m an outsider acting with bad intentions, it may be worth speaking with some of your largest clients, including the vendor who provided funding for equipment early on. I’ve independently confirmed that arrangement with multiple sources.
I had no malicious intent in running these tests. I paid for them myself because I wanted to independently confirm for the community that Kovera was running a clean operation. Had the results held up, I would have said so publicly. That would have reflected well on you and your lab.
I’m also aware that you’ve identified issues with testing from ILS and Freedom. I have a botched Freedom test sitting in my own email. No lab is perfect, and nobody reasonable expects one to be.
But equipment and methodology are only part of running a successful laboratory. Communication, consistency, and professionalism matter too. If customers believe results may be withheld because of a personal disagreement, they’ll hesitate to test with you, and they may also hesitate to rely on the RUO vendors whose products are supported by your COAs.
You didn’t have to agree with me or like how I raised the issue. You just needed to complete the work we paid for, or clearly tell us that you would not.
@Randy Hey buddy let me know here or a DM the cost of vials and shipping, I'll get that sent right over to ya.
"I’m also aware that you’ve identified issues with testing from ILS and Freedom. I have a botched Freedom test sitting in my own email. No lab is perfect, and nobody reasonable expects one to be."
If you were aware of this why allow blatantly false claims to be espoused here when you could have easily countered their statements.
Apologies but I'm not a member here and I'm not sure who is an admin, owner, or moderator but I was under the impression that Randy is in some sort of leadership position? If I'm mistaken I sincerely apologize.
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@Randy Hey buddy let me know here or a DM the cost of vials and shipping, I'll get that sent right over to ya.
"I’m also aware that you’ve identified issues with testing from ILS and Freedom. I have a botched Freedom test sitting in my own email. No lab is perfect, and nobody reasonable expects one to be."
If you were aware of this why allow blatantly false claims to be espoused here when you could have easily countered their statements.
Apologies but I'm not a member here and I'm not sure who is an admin, owner, or moderator but I was under the impression that Randy is in some sort of leadership position? If I'm mistaken I sincerely apologize.
@user_12968
Jeff (Randy) is the owner of this forum. He spends a TON of his own money checking and double checking vendors, labs, suppliers, etc. to post his findings on this board so that everyone on here can benefit.
He has saved everyone on here a ton of money by identifying less than honest vendors from taking our money and running.
Trust me, I am a Marine, I am no follower. I am rude and mean, but I am honest. In fact most of the people on this forum do not like me. But I can say with certainty that Jeff is speeding his money so everyone on this board benefits. -
@user_12968 Rude? I think the larger issue is that you accepted our money and samples, ran the tests, and then did not provide the results. After more than a month without results or meaningful communication, I had to file a chargeback.
And the chargeback only addressed the testing fee. The samples themselves cost money, they were gone, and the cost of shipping them to you was gone as well. Refusing to contest the chargeback did not make me whole or resolve the underlying problem.
You’ve now said the results were withheld because you objected to how I spoke to you. You don’t have to like a customer, but once you accept payment and samples, the professional options are to complete the work or promptly cancel the order, issue a refund, communicate that decision, and return anything that can still be returned.
Before assuming I’m an outsider acting with bad intentions, it may be worth speaking with some of your largest clients, including the vendor who provided funding for equipment early on. I’ve independently confirmed that arrangement with multiple sources.
I had no malicious intent in running these tests. I paid for them myself because I wanted to independently confirm for the community that Kovera was running a clean operation. Had the results held up, I would have said so publicly. That would have reflected well on you and your lab.
I’m also aware that you’ve identified issues with testing from ILS and Freedom. I have a botched Freedom test sitting in my own email. No lab is perfect, and nobody reasonable expects one to be.
But equipment and methodology are only part of running a successful laboratory. Communication, consistency, and professionalism matter too. If customers believe results may be withheld because of a personal disagreement, they’ll hesitate to test with you, and they may also hesitate to rely on the RUO vendors whose products are supported by your COAs.
You didn’t have to agree with me or like how I raised the issue. You just needed to complete the work we paid for, or clearly tell us that you would not.
Communication, consistency, and professionalism matter too. If customers believe results may be withheld because of a personal disagreement, they’ll hesitate to test with you, and they may also hesitate to rely on the RUO vendors whose products are supported by your COAs.
Bingo! Exactly! @randy
I stopped replying to Kovera owner but they said a client brought this thread to their attention and so they felt the compulsive need to hunt down the original sender and cross question and then call all that as fun.... than doing the job they were expected to do and paid for — to just test the sent vial sample and send results back!!!
THIS is what has caused a lot of questions on Kovera results' trustworthiness and honesty.
I see people including Glacier coming forward attesting Kovera and their test results, but now that's just an anecdotal evidence, not an attestation of Kovera's procedural and professional cleanliness, which is what matters in the long term for trust in consistency.
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@randy An RUO vendor coming forward to defend a testing lab owner's conduct is another red flag BTW.
I love/loved @glacier-aminos but unfortunately this whole saga and their Kovera defense is not clearing the water, but muddying it further.
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